roguecavaliers

Thanks for the tips Ska, I just got my Stiff Little Fingers tickets for tomorrow. It's in Northampton, not London, but close enough. And correct me if I'm wrong, but I heard something about the Pogues playing the Brixton Academy in December. So that should be fairly bitchin'.

LurpyThePirate wrote:Thanks for the tips Ska, I just got my Stiff Little Fingers tickets for tomorrow. It's in Northampton, not London, but close enough. And correct me if I'm wrong, but I heard something about the Pogues playing the Brixton Academy in December. So that should be fairly bitchin'.

Ohh man...Maybe I should stick around until the New Year over there!!

According to their website, they have the following UK dates:

* Tuesday, Dec 11: Glasgow Academy
* Wednesday, Dec 12: Newcastle Academy
* Friday, Dec 14: Nottingham Arena
* Saturday, Dec 15: Manchester G-Mex
* Sunday, Dec 16: Birmingham Academy
* Tuesday, Dec 18: Brixton Academy
* Wednesday, Dec 19: Brixton Academy
* Saturday, Dec 22: Belfast Nugent Hall
* Sunday, Dec 23: Dublin RDS Main Hall

Plus some dates in California before then.

Are these dates without Shane?

Nah, Shane is back with them, at least for the time being.

So you all later...I will be back right in time for the Gravy Cup!

Lurpy..see you in a few days.

COME ON YOU IRONS!!

WEST HAM 3-1 SUNDERLAND!

This was an awesome game! Though I have to admit I was a little disappointed that most of the fans were sitting throughout the game.

Pictures!


Judge in Upton Park.


The Boleyn. If anyone on here goes to a West Ham game I highly recommend this pub.


The pitch.


WTF? Are we back in Utah all of a sudden?

Awesome. I need to make a trip. Watched it this morning, not a bad match. Nice to have Bellamy back. As for standing fans and all that, England is a bit sensitive to that since Liverpool fans killed some people back at Hillsboro and Heysel in the 1980s. Other countries still have terraces, the Budensliga for example.

Donk, I know you are no fan of Liverpool but please do not try to fault history. The wrong in both cases was that of law enforcement and the orgranizations staging events poorly.

It is the fans of Liverpool that have for the past several decades demanded investingations of the events and have raised millions of pounds for the victims. Court cases in both instances have never laid a single bit of blame on the fans.

The problem in Heysel, were issues of ticket scalpers and the local police making stadium officals open the gates to the liverpool sections to get the liverpool fans off the streets. Scalpers had sold tickets to Jueve fans in the section directly next to liverpools fans, someone started throwing things (mostly parts of the crumbling stadium) and then chaos followed. Liverpool had actually asked the match be moved because of the state of the stadium and security.

Hillsborough was a cluster fu*k, where the police opened up the exits and allowed thousands of fans without tickets into a standing area, then for up to 30 minutes after people began getting crushed by the crowd, the police and stadium stewards ignored the problem while people died. The following investigation required the end of the traditional terrace (a standing only area without seats) and to this day many parks do not allow fans to stand at matches. The only offical investigation into the events laid blame on the police and their failure to control, and then their failure to respond correctly.

What an amazing time that was!!!
I have a bunch of pictures and thoughts on this match that I will post later.
Right now I am at my friends place in West Ham waiting for the traffic on the tube to die down a bit before I make my way to Kings Cross to catch a train to York.

f4denz wrote:Donk, I know you are no fan of Liverpool but please do not try to fault history. The wrong in both cases was that of law enforcement and the orgranizations staging events poorly.

It is the fans of Liverpool that have for the past several decades demanded investingations of the events and have raised millions of pounds for the victims. Court cases in both instances have never laid a single bit of blame on the fans.

The problem in Heysel, were issues of ticket scalpers and the local police making stadium officals open the gates to the liverpool sections to get the liverpool fans off the streets. Scalpers had sold tickets to Jueve fans in the section directly next to liverpools fans, someone started throwing things (mostly parts of the crumbling stadium) and then chaos followed. Liverpool had actually asked the match be moved because of the state of the stadium and security.

Hillsborough was a cluster fu*k, where the police opened up the exits and allowed thousands of fans without tickets into a standing area, then for up to 30 minutes after people began getting crushed by the crowd, the police and stadium stewards ignored the problem while people died. The following investigation required the end of the traditional terrace (a standing only area without seats) and to this day many parks do not allow fans to stand at matches. The only offical investigation into the events laid blame on the police and their failure to control, and then their failure to respond correctly.

I know what the facts were, it's just fun to bring up both incidents because the Liverpool fans get so defensive. On one hand though, I don't find it a coincidence that Liverpool fans were involved in both, but the animal behavior of the scousers while usually not a major problem, became a major problem in these two cases because of other causes. And yes, showing up to a match but still expecting to be let in, that's animal behavior.

Donk, please don't make me go into the history of the people of Praque.

If you want to throw stones, make sure you throw them at kids who will run away.

If the Jueve fans had thought of that maybe they would never had gotten into the fight at Heysel. It would have been much worse had the Liverpool fans sought to fight with the fans on the opposite end of the stadium, vs. the few that started the problems.

The reason both incidents involved Liverpool fans and most incidents in the 80's and 90's involved fans from the UK is simple they were the most passionate fans and they travelled in large numbers. And the real problems were locked behind an iron curtain, now if you look at the violence it is either eastern europe or italy. One is a group of criminals that want to take over the sport and the other are a bunch of racist bastards who still buy into the whole master race thing. I would much rather deal with rowdy drunk fans than either of those groups, the end result is that the police have been forced to do a much better job at matches and stadiums have had to move out of the stone ages and get caught up with current technology.

I find it interesting that many think that the hoolies of the 80's in the UK were responsible for the creation of the whole CCTV network, now the largest in the world.

f4denz wrote:Donk, please don't make me go into the history of the people of Praque.

If you want to throw stones, make sure you throw them at kids who will run away.

If the Jueve fans had thought of that maybe they would never had gotten into the fight at Heysel. It would have been much worse had the Liverpool fans sought to fight with the fans on the opposite end of the stadium, vs. the few that started the problems.

The reason both incidents involved Liverpool fans and most incidents in the 80's and 90's involved fans from the UK is simple they were the most passionate fans and they travelled in large numbers. And the real problems were locked behind an iron curtain, now if you look at the violence it is either eastern europe or italy. One is a group of criminals that want to take over the sport and the other are a bunch of racist s who still buy into the whole master race thing. I would much rather deal with rowdy drunk fans than either of those groups, the end result is that the police have been forced to do a much better job at matches and stadiums have had to move out of the stone ages and get caught up with current technology.

I find it interesting that many think that the hoolies of the 80's in the UK were responsible for the creation of the whole CCTV network, now the largest in the world.

Denz, I keep giving you shit because it's fun. I know what the history is with the ultras. I agree with you. The clubs agree with you, Sparta has made a big effort to stop out the racism and anti-semitism, as have others of the Czech league. That's where the difference is, Liverpool last year blamed UEFA for not having a big enough stadium for their fans' behavior instead of owning up and doing something concrete about their traveling fans. But yes, I will agree all of it is bad and needs to be addressed. It's sad when you tell someone you are a football fan and they automatically assume you are one of that small minority who act that way. It's also very sad how many US fans talk about being a hooligan as if in order to be a fan, you have to fight and be an ass. The problems of eastern europe were locked away, but the difference is that because of the two major incidents of the 1980s, by the 1990s, UEFA was a lot better equiped to deal with them.

I know Donk, it is fun giving you crap back. Listen there is no doubt that the Liverpool fans are a handful for anyone to handle, the only shame is that they still haven't burnt Manchester to the ground.

and in the mean time, THAT'S AWESOME JUDGE!!!